I have a question about punctuation. When you have a word that ends in a "s" and you want to write the possessive form of the word, do you put an apostrophe just after the s and that's all, or do you put an apostrophe after the s followed by another s ?
For example, if I wanted to refer to the logo for the Saints, would it be "The Saints' new logo" OR "The Saints's new logo"? I thought the former style was the proper one, but I was recently told that the latter is the correct punctuation.
Also, is it the same for both people names and other words? Thanx.
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I'll jus ' go an
AKS if yo is correct.........lol
oR yOu
could tell hEr thAt 39 CrAzy bULLdoGers, an oNe VEry sANe one SayS tHat shE pRobaBly doN't KNoW her aZZ fRom onE of deM HOleS iN dA gRouND!!!
Former copy editor here....
Since this is inherently confusing, I'd rewrite it to read, "The logo of the New Orleans Saints...."
No worries about the possessive.
Go back and get that degree!
you're so close!!

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Tell yo boss it aint none of his bidness..
nm
<
No problem....you want us to email your boss?
We can set her straight real quick LOL
believe it or not,
I left college about 3 classes shy of an english degree. My bible for those type of questions was the copy editors handbook, so I googled that, and selected what looked like the most respectable link.
Thanx to all who joined in
your responses have been great.

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the college grad who can't spell worth a darn says....
Saints' is correct.
Ok...i just got a headache reading your post...
too much thinking for me!! lol. Im not gooder in anglish enywaz.
And . . .
"rathe" should be "rather", lol. I'm on a roll tonite.

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Duh, that should read "not the only one" rathe than "now the onl
now you see why Clovis calls me Doofus.

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Agree with Cody!
And Gary, you know I edit everything that my lawyer boss writes.
It's The Saintsis' in Louisiana.
lol
<
LOL!
I'm reading this thinking... "This doesn't sound like Dr Seuss. How come it doesn't rhyme? Was he having an off day?" lol DUH!

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Thank you Dr. Seuss, lol
and you too, Jami! I'm gonna have to show that to the boss. Of course, she will then tell me not to use words like "gonna." Women, sigh.

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I just googled...
"possessive form when words in s" and all kinds of English sites came back...what is it with our bosses/boss's/boss' (LOL) making us do the work twice???
Lol, I'm amazed by the number of responses
and very grateful too. But I thought only two or three people would reply. Hopefully that means I'm now the only one on the board who enjoyed the book "Eats, Shoots & Leaves." I probably got that punctuation wrong too, lol.

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does this help?
the Dr Seuss one seems to be a similar situation
http://www.meredith.edu/grammar/plural.htm#apostrophe
That's very interesting because lately I have been working on so
and a lot of the Hispanic names end in either a "s" or a "z". So the boss has been kicking my memos back to me because I did not add a second s after the apostrophe. Can't recall for sure, but I think I may have doing the z names wrong, tho. For those, I think I did put an apostrophe and a "s" at the end, as in "Hernandez's suit was filed in the wrong venue."

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Now I would read the first as
Possessive, and the second as plural. I also can't believe how much we're kicking this question around! lol

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I think you can write it two ways
The Saints' or just The Saints.

Lol, I'll do that
so if y'all don't hear from me for a few weeks, it will be because she threw a heavy object at me and I'm not out of the hospital yet, <g>.

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I just did a quick search...
Saints' would be correct...
This is what one of the sites said:
When we want the possessive of a pluralized family name, we pluralize first and then simply make the name possessive with the use of an apostrophe. Thus, we might travel in the Smiths' car when we visit the Joneses (members of the Jones family) at the Joneses' home. When the last name ends in a hard "z" sound, we usually don't add an "s" or the "-es" and simply add the apostrophe: "the Chambers' new baby." As with most words that end in "s", no need to add an "s".
Not an English teacher either
but my recollection is that if the word is a singular, whether its a person or an object, and you want to make it possessive, you add apostrophy S. You might argue that an object cannot possess anything but that's another page! If the object is a collective plural, such as the Saints team, and you want to show possession you just add the apostrophy. Also if the name of the person ends in S, such as Strauss, and you want to show possession, you just add the apostrophy at the end. THT -E.
LOL And I agree with you...
teachers are seeing children in the lower grades that do not have the developed social skills that we did when we were children. But then again, maybe we were just exceptional children...without fleas.
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Tell your boss....40 Crazy BDWer's agree that it is Saints'
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I worry too that it may be bad for their socialization skills
it's almost like a return to the cave living days. Then again, even cavemen went out in the sun a lot. But they did have a bit of a flea problem, I guess, lol.

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Saints'
:D
Vicky,
Bosco, Bella, Breve' & Holly
http://www.rubarbsoap.com/
Bulldog Club of Greater Seattle
PHOTOS ARE PROPERTY OF LANGAGER BULLDOGS, YOU MUST HAVE WRITTEN PERMISSION FOR ANY USE OF THESE PHOTOS FROM LANGAGERBULLDOG.
It seems as though...
They start sooner and attend later into the summer. Of course, I don't remember getting off the extended stretches that they take for now a days for holidays. Around here, we also have snow days. Here's one that I could NOT believe... They give the kids off from school on the opening day of deer season! Yikes! Growing up in the city, I had never heard such a thing!

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I agree, it should be Saints'
...I was a homeschool teacher, does that count?


It's not just your neighborhood...
kids stay inside rotting their brains with tv & video games. It's actually pretty sad! We were never inside in the summer & I had band-aids on my knees all summer long from playing. And it does seem awfully early for school to be going back, I think my nephew goes back to school on August 27th.
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bosses think they know everything
lol
That's what I thought, but my boss insists I am wrong
I may have to sic Martha Stewart on her. Well, unless Martha agrees with her.

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I'm not an english teacher
but i've always been good at english, and as far as i know "The Saints' new logo" would be the correct way
BTW, my next door neighbor just told me that high school starts
wow, that seems crazy. When I was a kid, we didn't start back to school until the day after Labor Day. Then again, when I was a kid, you would see kids playing outside every day, all summer long. If we weren't out riding our bikes, we were playing baseball, basketball, Combat, etc. We even went outside if it rained, we would play board games like Stratego, Clue, Monopoly, etc., on the front porch.

I don't know if my subdivision is just different, but now I almost never see kids playing outdoors during the summer. It just seems unhealthy to not spend more time in the sun and get more exercise. I hope the computer age doesn't result in a lot of today's kids having a lot more heart attacks, and earlier on, than previous generations.
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Not an english teacher either...
Actually, fairly illiterate! lol I'm almost positive it's just an apostrophe after the 's' for the possessive.

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Not an English teacher but...
The Saints' New Logo...would be the correct answer.
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Not an English teacher, but,
I have a master's degree in journalism. Your boss is (if I may be redundant) WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! You are right. Nahhh, nahhhh, nahhh.
Also tell him that there are no apostrophes after numbers, as in these examples;
1) The cost of the condos begin in the $300s.
2) He was born in the 1960s.
However, you would use an apostrophe to indicate missing letters if you said;
3) He was born in the '60s.
Yay, you!
that is very helpful..
I often have problems with wording phrases. AND no matter what anyone says, "an historical" just doesn't sound right to me! I'd love to take a grammer class. I've forgotten so many of the rules.
Well thanks, but I don't know that I'm totally up to his level!
...I DO like to make up my own words from time to time when the regular ones don't quite fit!


My father would have loved you...
He was extremely articulate, and sure knew how to utilize the english language to it's fullest! The man was a stickler for pronunciation, annunciation, articulation, spelling, grammer, punctuation... Obviously, none of that rubbed off on me!

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It's always been my understanding that the same rule applies! AN
--another pet peeve is when a person pronounces it like a double "s" sound when they say it! (don't think THAT'S right either!)


so now I will know who to go to for grammer questions.
good to know.
What about a name like Villegas?
the name itself is not plural, it just naturally ends with a "s". So, would it be "Villegas' bulldog" or "Villegas's bulldog"?

Using the Saints as an example probably wasn't a good idea, since Saints is a plural version of Saint. But what about a person's name that just naturally ends with a "s"?
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