My views on breeding bulldogs
Submitted by Jacinda and the... on October 22, 2010 - 10:04pmI will start off by saying that I have never bred one of my girls. I have owned bulldogs for nearly 8 years and never had a litter of pups. With that being said, I think too many people breed for the wrong reasons. We should only breed to better the breed. Unfortunately, our breed has many health problems and we need to invest time and do the research before even considering breeding.
I can't tell you how many times I have heard the following reasons for breeding and they make me ill:
"I love my dog so much and would love to have a puppy from her."
"I paid a lot of money for my dog and I want to breed her to get my money back."
Just because your bitch has a uterus does not mean she should be bred. I'm not saying only Champions should be bred but, you should know that your dog is a good example of the breed before even thinking of breeding. Going to shows and examining the dogs and talking to exhibitiors is a good learning tool. You should also study the bulldog standard. There is no perfect bulldog but we should always strive to improve the breed. Novices breeding pets to pets without consideration does not improve the breed.
I know a lot of "pet" owners think "show" people are bulldog snobs. And I can say that yes, some of them are. But, that is certainly not the norm. Most show dog owners love and care for their show dogs as family members. My show dog is no more special to me than any of my other dogs and that includes my rescues. They are all treated the same except my show dog is groomed more and gets to go on more trips than the others.
I guess what I'm really trying to say is do your research first before breeding. Ask all the questions before you breed. Don't breed first and then ask questions later.
I have been following this forum for about 7 years. I have seen a lot of DRAMA and I have found that most of the time, the drama comes when people are being told they are wrong. People like to ask for help but they don't always like the answers they are given. My advice is that if you don't want the truth, then don't ask for an opinion.
Thanks for reading my rant.
I understand what you are talking about
People in my community see that Chumlee isn't neutered yet (he is only 8 months old), they make comments. "Are you going to breed him and make your money back off that guy?" "You going to get a female and make puppies?" I could throw up! I have no interest in breeding Chumlee he is my baby and I am not a professional. He will have his goodies until he is fully grown. The last week I have spent researching breed standards to see if my dog even measures up. I'm starting to feel that he isn't one that "measures up." I honestly didn't know what "frog face" was until 3 days ago. Someone mentioned that the board use to be show people and breeders and now it has turned into a pet forum, I feel mine and Chumlee's membership shouldn't have been approved if that what kind of board that this is supose to be and we don't belong here then. Yesterday I was researching breeders on this board because I will be getting Chumlee a brother in two years or so and there was some links up on the very top that I curiously clicked on. One had "rare black velvet bulldogs" and another had 15 females and 7 males and they advertised blue eyed bulldogs is that normal, I thought that was weird? Now these were not the ones in the breeder directory! They were in the top of the webpage screen. Does a partially pink nose fill in? How long do you usually wait on a waiting list?
Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!
Katie & Chumlee
BDW has always been open to all bulldog owners
I think I read the post you are refering to and I believe they said a "pet forum" as in all pets and not just bulldogs. I would say that most of the members of BDW are pet owners who do not show their dogs.
The ads you clicked on are obviously not good breeders devoted to the breed. Black bulldogs and bulldogs with blue eyes are not rare nor are they desirable traits in a bulldog. I would stay away from anyone advertising those types of bulldogs.
I have often had people come up to me when I have the girls with me and offer up a stud dog to use to breed them. I calmly explain to them that my girls are spayed. I've also had people come up to me at shows wanting to use my boy for stud. I am VERY selective when it comes to using my boy for stud. In fact, I have only used him once. I am not in bulldogs for the money and have never made any money off any of my dogs.
It's great that you are researching breeders now. If you need any help or advice or just someone to listen to your ideas, feel free to email me.
Sometimes pink noses fill in. It may take awhile and it depends on how much of the nose is pink. You can give poly-vi-sol and liquid kelp to help the pigment come in.
Thank you
for the response :) I did pass on a few pups before I got Chumlee because of the pink nose. I have seen some birthday pictures on here when they show the puppy when they were little and then growing up and their noses have filled in. That is why I was curious...
Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!
Katie & Chumlee
The General and Medical Forums are for all Bulldog owners.
Only the show forum is restricted to show folks. 90 percent of the people on this board have ALWAYS been pet owners. I don't know why other old time members think otherwise. That is why David, the previous owner of this forum and Mr. Bulldog Extraordinaire, created the general side, while the serious breeders and show people posted on the show forum. He knew we weren't all breeders and show folks, so accommodated that. As do the new owners of the board.
I would not worry at all about it. You are a delightful and well liked member of BDW. Don't ever think otherwise:-)
Amy and Sophia
Thank you Amy
I don't know what it was like before so I have no idea what to compare it to. All I know is that we would be lost without all of you!
Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!
Katie & Chumlee
I said that about pet forum
I have heard so many times that the forums have 'changed' from what they used to be, and I made that comment about show to pet. I thought all along that they were referring to all us pet owners making the board less than what it was. But now I don't think that's what they meant at all.
I was really flabbergasted at how vehemently show breeders were labeled as snobs, and just doing it for themslves/money/don't treat their dogs like family. There seems to be a negative attitude towards them whenever they say ANYTHING about health or conformation. I think that when they try to point out that this forum has changed, it is THAT attitude that has a lot to do with it. So many are pet owners, me included, and we can get our feathers ruffled if we even THINK that a show breeder is criticisizing our dogs' health, conformation, OUR choice of breeder. They have a lot of experience in the breed in general, and when someone makes a mistake, they say it. Some more eloquently or kindly than others. When someone comes along that has a dog with a problem they have been, collectively, trying to address in the breed as a whole, it has GOT to be frustrating for them. It perpetuates the stigma of poor health attached to bulldogs, increases the pressure from organizations trying to forever alter the bulldogs that we all know and love, and forces them to work even harder to make SURE the bulldog breed as we know it today is not allowed to or forced into becoming something else. Do you know that in England they already HAVE made that change? We as pet owners very frequently do NOT get involved in the breed on such a fundamental level. We love them, feed them, bathe them, play with them, take care of their health issues, but do not do anything beyond that to ensure that the breed continues on. That is NOT a problem. The problem is when breeders who ARE dedicating countless time, money, blood sweat and tears to the future of bulldogs, are treated like they are only speaking up here because of their own egos. Or when they are told that they do not truly "Love" the breed because they highly value a conformationally superb dog, or because they don't rescue. Some rescue folk go too far in their claims of superior "Love". Many bulldogs are in need of a home because of poor breeding causing health issues, or because the breeder did not put too much thought into whom they sold a dog to. These breeders are the ones who are damaging the breed as a whole and forcing responsible breeders to work even harder to overcome that negative attached to breeding purebred dogs. I said it before and I will say it again, that kind of dedication to a breed of dog IS LOVE, and that LOVE IS VALID.
Pet owners need to not get so prickly when conformation, health, showing, standards, POOR breeding, is discussed. I apologize sincerely for MY prickly attitude. I LOVE bulldogs, and can not imagine a world where they do not exist. I am not going to breed them. I know this, and I am not too proud of myself for NOT doing more to support those who ARE dedicated and fighting to make sure bulldogs will still be around for my grandchildren, and their grandchildren.
Cathy and Audrey
Mainly the format is what changed. Many old timers wouldn't
Make the change for whatever reasons, but they all had the choice to stay on BDW with the rest of us. Many just wanted BDW to forever stay the same as it was, but the new owners had every right to make it whatever they wanted it to be. Frankly, the "change" that took place was a lot of good breeders, show folks, etc, wouldn't use the new BDW format because the format changed.... their choice, but we pet owners still have the forums going and except for this past week, very little fussing between members has gone on. Do I miss those folks who left? Mostly, but some caused more trouble with their pride and arrogance than any pet owner I know of! The board has been slightly less contentious since a few of them bailed out!
Breeders are NOT always concerned with the end result of their breedings. Take the recent issues with Laura (and I am not against her breeding, just hear me out!). She had her female bred to a "national champion" dog. But her girl isn't a champion, never showed, we don't know if she is even a good standard of the breed. I imagine she is, but I don't know. Now, why did the "national champion" stud owner feel like they should breed a female that hasn't shown nor will show if they are so concerned with improving the breed as they say? I don't know, but it wasn't to improve the breed standard, I guarantee it. Laura, however, wants a show dog out of this mating. She should not expect one if her girl isn't one herself in my opinion, but again, that is only my opinion. No one else has to agree with me. I know that I will NOT get a champion running horse out of a horse that hasn't run. I know I won't get a champion Reining horse out of horses that haven't been bred to rein. I know I won't get an improved conformation in a foal that comes from parents with sub standard conformation. As a champion horse owner, I WILL NOT breed one of my top mares to anything that isn't a champion stallion that will absolutely, unequivocally improve the lines and conformation my girls have. I just WILL NOT do it. I have some superior mares in my herd, the lesser mare of my group will never, ever be bred. No matter what. Never. The jury is still out on my new girl on breeding her until I see what she looks like with another couple hundred pounds on her. Then I can decide if she is of good enough quality to breed, even though she has some of the most famous racehorses in history on her pedigree. If this were a dog pack the same thing would apply. If that dog that is being thought of to breed isn't perfect standard and conformation, I would absolutely NOT be breeding him/her for any reason whatsoever. No amount of money would be enough to convince me to breed either a lesser dog to a champion female, nor a champion dog to a lessor female. Sorry, but that is how breeders SHOULD be. Too many who claim to be such great lovers of this breed are NOT that way, and there is where issues like poorly bred and sickly Bulldogs come in, and they leave a bad name behind them in the breeding world. And some of breeders I have known will rescue, but they still are willing to plop out puppies several times from each female they have and sell them to pet households. What happens should the new owners need to re-home the dog 3 or more years down the road? I only know of ONE breeder personally that fought to take a dog back that was from one of her litters that needed to be re-homed. One breeder, out of all the breeders I know. Does that mean no other breeders won't do this? No, but the fact that I only know one that will is important here.
Rescue folks have Friday and Saturday each week that they can post all they want about their rescues, they just can't ask for donations. Many stopped posting about rescues all together though, they got mad at the rules that had to be placed about rescues asking for money and SO many OMG URGENT RESCUE IN NEED posts were happening, Dave put a stop to it. Lots of breeders got ruffled because really, if you breed, rescue, and that was preached to them by the rescues. That is a good standard to live by, but many don't and the rescues fussed at the breeders, breeders fussed at the rescues, and so neither post much any more. More and deeper reasons are behind some that stopped posting, but tragically the shallow reasons stated above are why a lot stopped.
I really don't see much change otherwise. We are still about Bulldogs. We still love and pray for each other, care about each other, cry over losses and laugh over each new frolicking puppy pictured. We still ask questions and need advice, help, guidance and friendship. Those who are still around appreciate the boards, those that are gone never appreciated them to the extent they could have is my opinion. And that is important...my opinion is not necessarily what others may agree or disagree with, it is only my opinion. I have been here for 4.5 years and will be here for as along as BDW is around I expect. I hope you will be too.
And if anyone thinks I am aiming this at any of you, you are wrong. I am simply stating a response to Cathy about the board and how/why it has changed. Frankly, I am still loving it, and wish those who have stopped posting as much would come back, buck up, put on their big girl panties, and POST!!! I miss them a lot:-)
Amy and Sophia
I noticed the attitudes before the format changed
maybe the format change was just the excuse some used to make it official they were leaving. I have defintiely noticed a negative attitude towards show people from some that are strictly pet owners, some get VERY defensive, and I have myself a few times, when they think that pet quality is being criticised. I am just saying that I had a moment recently, where I realized, Oh snap! Maybe that attitude is what they are talking about! NOT that pets aren't as good as show dogs.
The fact that some breeders aren't real concerned about the end results of their breeding is EXACTLY my point! There are groups that vocally advocate changing the bulldog standard, basically forever altering the bulldog as we know it today. Indiscriminate breeders are making it harder and harder for legit ones to prove it IS possible to breed healthy bulldogs that aren't a walking health disaster. There is more to breeding bulldogs than simply conformation, and actually conformation should not be the #1 consideration. Champion or not, and unhealthy dog should NOT be bred. Making HEALTHY bulldogs should be the #1 consideration. Breeders who are only concerned about winning and do not care if the dog has serious genetic problems are only adding fuel to those groups that think bulldogs are a travesty of human production and should be forced out of existance. So no I do not agree with you 100% that ONLY Champion dogs should be bred. I do think peer reviewd conformation judging is necessary to continue the breed, but it is not the ONLY thing that matters to ensure the continuance of the breed. I don't know about the major health concerns of running horses vs reining horses, but I don't think breeding horses for different uses has the major health issues that face breeders of bulldogs. Maybe the horses aren't going to win a race, but are they going to have life threatening heart conditions? Require surgery to breathe? Have such terrible itchy skin it will be miserable? Do they even have conformation judging on race horses vs reining horses? We have ALL heard about how unhealthy bulldogs are. The normal average person we meet on the street has no clue if the bulldog they are looking at conforms to the standard or not, and most don't care, but so many specifically mention how unhealthy they are. They don't ask, "Do her ears meet the standard?" They ask, "Can she breathe? Does she stink? Does she have horrible skin?". Never mind what vets think. There ARE breeders working dilligently to overcome these issues, and some of them are/were here. But if they tried to speak of the issues, many times they were pounced on by those who felt their pet dogs were being insulted.
I don't think it's fair to use Laura as an example, because we do NOT know enough about the people that were involved in the breeding of her dog. She has a mentor she trusts that has been involved in showing and breeding bulldogs for a long time. Her mentor has people she trusts also, she did not do this alone. Can we say for certain her mentor is not qualified to make a decision on what breeding would be beneficial to the breed? The stud dog owner was never mentioned, it is simply not possible to determine their motives with NO information whatsoever. You yourself said that you will not consider breeding your horse until you see what she looks like after gaining weight. What makes you qualified to make a decision on what animal is worthy to be bred? Your experience? I am NOT TRYING to insult you, judge you or say you shouldn't be breeding animals, but just trying to point out that Laura could very well be in a situation where she used the experience and advice of her mentor to make a decision. And that without knowing her mentor, you can't just say she did not breed her dog with bettering the breed in mind, or that it is not possible to get a show quality puppy from her.
I honestly can not say how many breeders truly follow their dogs placed in pet homes throughout their lives, or if they would refuse to take one back if the owners needed to re-home it. It does seem a bit hypocritical if they put it in a contract that they must be informed if the dog needs to be re-homed, then refuse to take it back if rescue was the only other option. Seems like a lot of contracts from breeders have that in there. I don't disagree with rescues frustration about breeders pumping out unhealthy dogs and selling them carelessly, I disagree with the statement I have been hearing a lot lately that ALL breeding of purebred dogs is irresponsible and purebred dog breeders/exhibitors do not TRULY love the breed.
Again, PLEASE do not think I am trying to insult you! Sometimes in writing it is very hard to determine tone, and I can have a tendancy to sound like a smartass, but I PROMISE you I am just trying to voice my opinions, no insult intended!
And I agree that it is all about the love of bulldogs, but I do wish people would not jump to conclusions about the motivations and intentions of others write, give others the benefit of the doubt, and when unclear simply ASK that person for clarification before the tempers flare. I have admitted that I have assumed a few times, then later had clearer thinking that OOPS! maybe they did not mean that at all. Kindness in delivery is always appreciated also. I miss the opportunity to ask my billion and a half questions about the breed standard, health and genetics and breeding. Who is still here that is qualified to answer?
Cathy and Audrey
Yep:-)
And I specifically said I wasn't saying that Laura had done wrong...that I don't know anything about her dog or situation. I am only talking generally overall about breeders who will breed to anything for gain, not for superior animals. And I believe experience SHOULD be the voice for those who breed. I am an experienced horsewoman who knows breed standards and conformation better than a lot of horse people out there. I have studied it and followed it for years and years and years. It took me over 4 years to find a stallion worthy of my top mare:-) So for me to breed her is very, very serious business to me. Same as it should be for any other breeder of any other animal. See, the thing is, I am not positive the foal will be perfect, but I know that I can place it in a fantastic home should it not be a running foal, and the lines of that baby will carry it throughout it's lifetime by adding value to it. Would I tell the people who wind up with that baby to breed it if it wasn't right when it hit the ground? No! I would tell them that under no circumstance should they breed that baby. Never. That is what a good breeder should be doing. I also will rescue all day long, and take those animals that are unwanted and abused/neglected, and care for them for their lifetimes just because they desperately deserve it as much as any of my champions do. That is the fair and right thing to do.
So you and I see eye to eye, and agree with each other on the main and serious points. And I like that about you. You are knowledgeable, smart, and open to helping others, and I am the same way:-) So hang in there, we are on the same page...and I do SINCERELY hope Laura has some beautiful babies at her home right now that she is delighting in every moment. There is nothing better than babies you have waited and waited for finally arriving and being able to hold and love on them:-)
Amy and Sophia
Good Questions about contracts
and breeders following their puppies during their lives. I know what my contract says,
I would like to know what percentage of dogs that come into rescue are actually from reputable breeders? I know they don't keep these stats but it would be interesting. Seems to me that I have hear that they are strays with no knowledge of their past or non-reputable breeders like BYB or mills or owner surrenders. Not sure if the breeders are ever contacted by the owner. All the breeders I know, their contract states that the owner must contact the breeders before rehoming the dog. Owners don't follow the contract and just rehome the dog without ever contacting the breeder. They also sell on limited registration (meaning pet companion only, not to be used for breeding purposes). Heck my #2 pick puppy was sold on limited registration. If he turns out and the young man is interested in showing him then I will lift the limited registration.
I know many breeders who are very involved in rescue
I think we all get a little defensive when we think our babies are being insulted. Most of the time I don't think insult was intended but it's sometimes hard to determine tone when reading a forum.
I once had a lady email me because she "didn't like the tone" of my post. This lady had been asking for advice on her dog for weeks for the same problems but didn't take the advice that was offered. After taking the time to answer her questions again and again I did get a little frustrated. But, I was never rude. My only intention was helping the dog. Of course, if I have to hurt someone's feelings to help a dog then so be it. Some people just don't get it that it's really all about the dogs.
It IS all about the dogs!
That's why the breeding issue is such a sticker for me. I am sure there are breeders that rescue, I only know of one that does, that's all. If more ethical breeding was done there would be less need if rescue, but that isn't going to happen in any species!
Amy and Sophia
Arghhh those links!
Depending where I navigate on the homepage here on bdw, I see ads/links to importer brokers and mills :( I just hope others are as wise as you are and recognize those links are not to reputable breeders.
Yes, what's up with those links???
Webbies need to fix that pronto.
Amy and Sophia
Those google ads aren't cool
I would hate for someone to come here researching the breed and end up clicking one of those links and purchase a puppy fom one of those shameful businesses :( very unbulldogworld like
They are awful
Not a good representation of this board.
You're welcome
Two of my dogs had a little bit of pink on their noses but it filled in completely after a few months.
Thank you Jacinda. Well stated and easily read:-)
I agree fully.
Amy and Sophia
Thanks Amy!
You're the best!
Personally, show or no show, bred or no breed
WE ARE ALL BULLDOG OWNERS!!!
I am not a breeder, I never want to be a breeder of ANYTHING. I don't have the time, the patience, the money or the desire. I LOVE that I have found two excellent breeders of both my babies with those not so perfect fur kids to make my own because I do prefer a certain breed of pure bred dog over a mutt. I don't want a show dog, because I don't have time to show. I want a certain breed that I can spay/neuter and have as a pet. And in some circles THAT makes me a dog snob. But what can I say, I like the imperfect babies.
I think the breeders get their noses out of joint with the pet people just as much as the other way around. And this is not just on this board. My hat goes off to those that take the time to make the breed better for ALL of us.
I don't know what the board was like before and won't pretend I do. I love these forums because I came here when I got Farley knowing what he had and got some FANTASTIC information. I went to another board and got bashed for even *thinking* about taking him even though I has already talked him over with my Vet and the Specialist with the records I got from my breeders Vet. It's just a shame that in the last few weeks this place has gone from an informational and fun tool for ALL OF US to a place where drama and bickering abounds.
I hate the drama
This place has certainly had a lot of it over the years. One thing I've learned is that if you have a bulldog, you need tough skin. I think people are sometimes a little too sensitive and take things that are said on this board too personally.
Not fully true honestly
It's a known fact that several Champions and their lines are producing unhealthy stock. Ones with heart problems, dying at an early age etc. Maybe you really need to do the proper research and learn about the issues pure bred dogs face. Sometimes it's good to breed to new blood, regardless if you think it's right or not. Wouldn't life be perfect if it was so "Black and White" ?? Unfortunately it's not. I actually like seeing new blood mixed in with Champions to help the breed, rather than a lot of the inbreeding that goes on. So I honestly think your logic is flawed big time, especially since it is well known that one of the most successful breeders in the US had a dog damn near die at a dog show, because of some serious health problems. But wait the dog looked perfect to standard, and looked so good, but there you go with it almost dropping dead at under 5 years old. I like my girl that's lived to 10 years old and still has a few years left in her. Was she from champion to champion breeding? Nope. She was from a backyard breeder who bred two english bulldogs together. And yes, she does look like a bulldog.
I think you misunderstood my post
I'm not saying that all "show breeders" are good breeders because they are not. I know of several stud dog owners that will breed to anyone that can come up the stud fee. I personally saw a top dog go down in the ring and that was very scary. I would never breed to that line. The point is you have to do research so that you find out these things. Research the pedigree for not only conformation but also health and temperment. Most back yard breeders do not put forth this effort. Sure, sometimes they will get lucky and the dogs they throw together produce a nice puppy but, most time's that is not the case. It's a well know fact that "mutts" are healthier than pure breed dogs. But, I love bulldogs and through careful breeding we can eliminate these known genetic defects.
I also never said you have to breed Champion to Champion. But, you should breed nice dogs that complement each other. I don't believe pets should be bred to pets. I have nothing against pet quality dogs. I have several of them. My point is you should breed to better the breed. If this doesn't happen, the breed we all love so much will not be the same.
I know the issues pure bred bulldogs face. Would you like for me to list the health problem my girls have faced? I have seen first hand these effects and that's one of the reasons why we all need to do our research.
Here's a sample of my girls health problems.
Maizy: Entropian on all four lids, elongated soft palate, pyometra, dry eye
Morgan: Distichia (2 surgeries), elongated soft palate, hip dysplasia since age 2, alllergies
Bella(rescue) a former breeder: severe dry eye which was left untreated and is now almost completely blind, ear infections left untreated which caused narrow ear canals and is almost completly deaf
So don't tell me I don't know the issues. I have made mistakes but I have learned from them. I continue to educated myself on this breed.
Not exactly
The general forum came first and the medical and show forums were created because the important medical posts were getting lost with all the general fun posts. It was pretty typical for there to be 5+ pages a day of posts. I'm not exactly sure when the show forum was created but I believe it was around the same time the medical forum was created.
The show forum is not for show people only, pet owners are welcome to join in. They infact have always been encouraged to join in. Most people who show were pet owners first with no intentions of ever showing but they got interested in it and decided to give it a try, met nice people, created friendships and started going to shows. Most of us had pet quality bulldogs first. Very few people were born into dogs and dog showing like I was.
Why is their a need to put people that show in a separate pot from pet owners and then tell us we don't love our dogs. We are all pet owners...even the top breeders have dogs that live in their homes and sleep with them...and they love them as much as anyone else.
Deb, I only meant there was a forum for those who show...
but never said it was restricted to show folks only. I have posted on there many times over the years. Funny thing though, I never get a response:-)
I know show people and good breeders absolutely love their dogs. I didn't intimate they didn't. I was talking about people who breed indiscriminately.
I hope this clarifies my portion of what was said.
Amy and Sophia
No Response --- No one posts on the show
forum here. There are other forums that are frequented by reputable breeders and people who show. Depending on the subject or question or what people are doing you may not always get a response. I didn't always get a response either.
I wasn't referring to YOU personally in regards to us loving our dogs. I think you know differently. BUT that statement was exactly what was said and it seems it was well supported by everyone but Cathy. No one objected to the statement, that only people who rescue love their bulldogs and that breeders will never love their dogs like that. I was called a stuck up snob, I guess because I show and feel it is important to find a reputable breeder that breeds healthy, good temperment, quality dogs. I'm so happy I don't have ALL those health issues that everyone one else seems to have. Heck I don;t have to wipe butts, no tail pockets to clean, don.t even have to wipe nose ropes. Infact my dogs mus be so neglected because they don't require anything but daily feeding and watering. I think health testing is important and found it interesting that the buyers looking for puppies could have cared less about the health testing....color was far more important.
I don't understand that either
There are of course puppy millers that treat their dogs like livestock and just breed for the money. But, for small show breeders, there isn't much money involved.
The statement that only people who rescue love their dogs is just ignorant. Maybe that person is a rescue snob.
I know there is limited activity on the show forum...
Which is sad to say. I don't really expect any reply with no one on that forum. I posted one time on the big breeders/show forum about something and didn't get one reply there, either...so I don't worry about it, though I am interested in showing, I just never will:-) So no skin off my teeth.
And anyone who said that only rescue folks love Bulldogs must have a screw loose! I know the good breeders love the breed so much that they will only have a litter if it will exceed the current parents conformation and quality:-) Never said otherwise. When I was talking about my horses and how particular I am about breeding them, I also mentioned all species breeders should be like that. I know there re Bulldog breeders who feel that way.
Amy and Sophia
reason being
the new owners made a rule almost a year ago that only previous show side posters and breeders on the breeders list can have access to the show side. And since probably 90% of the old time show people don't post, the board gets little posts.
Sue
All photos are copyright and cannot be used.
an observation and one comment
I opened this whole thread at once to read it, tried but couldn't reply to a specific post. I am only gonna comment on one specific thing. Someone said something along the lines of breeders vs pet people or them not liking us. Sorry if this isn't exactly what was said - now I can't find that post. In no way do I believe this. Breeders like, need and depend on us pet owners because without us, where would they place their pups or young dogs who do not conform to the standard enough to be shown. I have a great repore with every breeder I know and have never felt slighted by any of them. I have never heard a breeder, and I know tons of breeders across the US, say we are 'just' pet owners. The only place I ever heard that was when I was a member of my local bulldog club yrs and yrs ago and I was basically called a lowly pet owner by a few members.
Sue
All photos are copyright and cannot be used.
Well said
I too, have been around this forum for over 7 years, I am mostly a read only, but once in awhile I might make a remark. Jacinda's thread was well said.
Alison and my little girl Matilda