CathyandAudrey avatar image

Laura

copied from your earlier post:

 

I've started researching   GOOD! Keep reading! There is a LOT of information available. The main thing you want to make sure of is that you understand the physiology of animal you are feeding. For most of us the furthest we ever went with understanding our dog's digestive system is to open a bag of kibble and put it in a bowl. We just assumed the contents were appropriate and healthy. Good for you for challenging that and deciding to LOOK at what you are feeding your dog. Now you just need to be ceratin you understand what your dog needs.Many also make the mistake of applying human nutritional guidelines to their dogs. Most dog food ads deliberatley lead you in that direction. They are banking on the fact that so many consider their dog a part of the family and hope you'll fall for their ploy that they are providing a balanced diet for them, just like YOU eat. Wrong Wrong Wrong!!  A carnivorous diet is a fairly simple one. ALL their nutrients come from animals, and that is the SIMPLEST way too feed your dog. You can certainly add plants into it, but now you've complicated things. To make certain your dog is getting all she needs from animals, consider an animal body. It has a LOT of muscle meat, a bit of organs, and bones. So feed your dog LOTS of muscle meat, a bit of organ and bones. :-) The ratio is roughly 80% muscle, 10% organ 10% bone. It is not an exact thing, you will have to adjust it to suit your dog. It will be pretty close to that though. It will also take an adjustment period for your dog's kibble-trained digestive system to switch to raw digesting. Kibble changes their stomach pH.

 

So here is my question, tonight I made my dog a raw meal and after reading your advice I was easy on the veggies/fruits. I kept them in though thinking maybe they'd add a little flavor that Stella might like better than the regular meat.   I really don't think you are going to have much trouble with your dog liking raw meat. It is possible, but give it a try.

I put 1/2 a lb of ground beef, 8 slices of beef heart, 5 blue berries and 10 spinach leafs and 1 dog vitamin. This completely filled up my blender so it was a lot of meat for sure. I blended it and then gave it to both my bulldog and Lab and they thought that was the greatest thing on earth. - I wonder if the veggies/fruits made me any difference in flavor or if maybe they just like beef heart or ground beef more than liver. I doubt that 5 little blueberries altered the taste signifigantly. All my dogs devour ground beef, so my guess would be it was that they loved so much.

So you normally feed bone too? I've not read a whole lot about that. Are there certain bones that will be dangerous? I've heard of bones spintering and killing dogs. Is that just cooked bones? Bones are vital and necessary. Minerals, vitamins, fiber, you have to add bone. Yes it is true that COOKED bones are brittle and should never be fed. Most feed chicken bones because they are easily chopped with a meat cleaver, or pounded or ground. Bulldogs do have a unique bite that needs to be considered. Your bulldog may not have any problems at all crunching chicken bones, your lab certainly won't. MY bulldog does have a problem crunching bone, her adult teeth never showed up, so she only has 2 upper and 2 lower crunching teeth. Not efferctive at all for bone crunching. So my husband chops them into smaller pieces for her. Bones also keep their teeth clean, beautifully clean. Judy is an awesome source of info for that. I think she feeds lamb ribs? Like I said, Audrey's teeth, or lack therof, are a problem for her, so we have to be careful with what we give her to chew.

Also, since I'm trying to stay away from salt, I read that beef and pork are the least salty meats. Is there a reason you prefer chicken or is there a reason you don't like beef  You do not need to be concerned about the natural sodium level in meat. You just need to make sure the meat you buy has not been enhanced. If it has a sodium content higher than 80, it has probably been enhanced. My dog has been eating raw long enough now that the very rich, higher fat beef does not bother her. For a dog that is just starting raw, beef can cause impressive diarrhea. It is very rich, and ground meat, even the leaner kinds, do have a lot of fat. That's why chicken is a good meat to start with. Chicken has a fairly high bone content, so it helps new raw eaters have firmer poops. It's lower fat is easier to digest. As your dog's stomach pH gets to it's natural, intended level, you can start to add to her diet. Switch her meat, add the organs. Just give her body a chance to adjust. Many dogs go through a detox also. My bulldog Audrey had the NASTIEST BLACK gunky gooey nose rope for close to 6 months. Now it only needs routine washing.

I also highly recommend you give probiotics. Audrey is super sensitive, so I do not give her any dairy, but some do give yogurt. Audrey gets powdered probiotics/enzymes. Even when my dogs were kibble fed I gave them probiotics.

Keep reading!

 

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Cathy and Audrey  

judy wilson's picture

keep it simple

the  reason so many people dont do raw feeding is becasue they try to make it to complicated...everything on your dog food bag is not necessary....does your dog need vegetables no but we as their humans like to add them...and thats ok just keep them to a min..or a weekend add on...does it have to be raw no...i  use my wok alot and give them a quick stir fry...especially if their has been a recall on chicken or beef.....protein i dont get to caught with that..most grain free foods are 30 to 40% protein and most comes from the cheap grains they buy...

your raw fed dog will be leaner..if to thin add more food to fat go less...your dog is going to use more of what he eats than with kibble. .more is going to supply muscle....i  use lamb rib bones i give a couple a day for them to chew on...if their poop is hard and white i back off for a couple of days...i feed twice a day with noon snack of beef heart...a little tripe...i add 1/2  teaspoon of freash garlic....not into vegetables....i do give a tablesppon of yougurt once a week yogurt is very processed and has alot of sugars...i use all natural honey with the comb bits still in it...excellant immunity builder.diet...is this my exact  diet no...i feed mostly chicken and tukey....and rabbit when i can...pork only in the form of pig feet and tails....

their is a excellant group of raw feeders on face book...a good group not into the do it this way or else as seen in some other groups...great ideas and suggestions...

wilson 3 years on raw  (he is a little fat but i like a fatty)

CathyandAudrey's picture

Judy what is the FaceBook group?

I'd love to check it out.

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Cathy and Audrey  

judy wilson's picture

i tried

to get back on face book but for some reason it wont let me in.....i think if you just type raw feeding into search you will get it....nice group nice discussion.....i will try face book again but just try typing into search till i can

CathyandAudrey's picture

I did try a search

and there are several. I have no desire to be bombarded with one way only raw feeders, they grate on my nerves.

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Cathy and Audrey  

judy wilson's picture

oh! stop that and

get in your car and run over a few squirrels hahahahahaha just joking.... i cant acess face book right now for some reason its down....these guys are no veggies no additives ect...they are just kinder in their words...when asking questions...i would never go on and say hey i added carrots and beans to my food...then you might get alot of flack...but their are some good ideas on different meat....and how to solve some problems...i just ingore the rest of shoot it gut it eat it group.....or run it over and pick up dead from the side of the road....

can you imagine the look on wilson face if i found his food on the side of the road...he wont even eat food off the floor....my brother droped a pc of steak on the floor...wilson would not touch it till he picked it up pretened to bush it off and feed him....spoiled !!!!!!!!

you found that where?????????

!!!

CathyandAudrey's picture

ROTFLMAO!

yeah, I think I'll avoid car-hunting. ;-0

I don't add any veggies, Audrey just throws them up, but it still does make me CRAZY when people are so rigidly fixated on ONE way to feed the millions of canines on the planet! UGGG! It is so unrealistic to even suggest that every single dog should eat in exactly the same way.

WILSON! You crack me up! HAHAHA that's hilarious! My daughter gets so frustrated because Audrey doesn't eat stuff off the floor either. She always says she's not a 'real' dog cause she'll just look at it.

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Cathy and Audrey  

Katie and Chumlee MN's picture

*side note ladies

I'm afraid to feed Chumlee raw because I don't want him to crap in his crate when I'm at work from 7 to 4....

 

I'm scared.....He has such a weak stomach.....

 

Carol I have your books that you suggested forever saved in my amazon.com cart.

 

I HATE KIBBLE

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Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!

 

Katie & Chumlee


I know, I was the same way.

Carina's book was invaluable to me. I am not yet prepared to feed Prey Model Raw. She has a relaxed form of feeding raw that makes me feel comfortable at present. Why not get Chumlee a chicken back and watch him closely to see what he does with it? 

Raw works great for Kofi and me, but we are just feeling our way along, that's why I recommend that others do their research to see what works for them.

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Kofi and Carol

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Katie and Chumlee MN's picture

I've been digging and digging online

And reading and there is so much info out there.  It was nice to see what you ladies have been talking about and now it is making sense to me because I have been learning.  I searched the local bookstores by me and I'm currently waiting for the confirmation email from one verifying stock for in-store pickup.  I'm excited to be able to sit down and settle into a book rather than scan the screen like I have been doing. 

__________________

Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!

 

Katie & Chumlee


That's what I needed to do also

We have wonderful help on this site, but I was still nervous. Reading has helped me to make raw feeding work. I am still learning as I go. I am trying to implement different raw feeding procedures that will work for Kofi and me. At present, I grind some raw meaty bones, and add some veggie glop for fiber. Then I also give her some raw meaty bones (miss cut chicken breasts, chicken backs, ect.). She also loves beef ribs, and oxtails. 

This is just the beginning for us, but reading practical, well balanced people has helped me on this interesting journey.

Good health to Chumlee, and to you too!

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Kofi and Carol

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By the way...

good for you for not going off half cocked! 

I think the reason that raw feeding often fails is that people start before being informed.

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Kofi and Carol

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Katie and Chumlee MN's picture

Re: By the way

I was thinking the other day "how in the world did I find BDW?"

I think I was looking for wrinkle cleaner or ointment when Chumlee first went irritated.  Google gave me some results and I started lurking then I was addicted.  Now where would we be without all of yous????!!!

And because of all of this learning it has developed a super awareness of pre-education before doing ANYTHING with your bully.

 

Thank you Carol

__________________

Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!

 

Katie & Chumlee


Katie and Chumlee MN's picture

They emailed me

and they have my book on hold!  Yay!  We were at a different grocery store tonight and saw some oxtail and tripe.  I didn't buy any I just pointed it out to Shawn and said hey that's the stuff we are going to get someday.  He just kind of looked at me like what?  I've been telling him a little about it here and there.  But now that the gears are slowly moving a little more I have been talking more about it and he has been asking about it all night.  I've got a lot to learn.....

 

Thanks Carol  <3

__________________

Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!

 

Katie & Chumlee


Well, it sounds as if the fella that sits

at the other end of the couch is pretty awesome!

I promise, Chumlee will give you both mucho globbers!!!

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Kofi and Carol

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Thanks Ladies

I'm still reading and researching. I'm not sure that starting raw right this moment is right for us. I had my reasons for starting raw... reasons that demanded she have a low-sodium diet with lots of iron and antioxidants and as little pollutants as possible... But I'm worried that I'll do more harm than good so I'll wait a couple of months and in the mean time I'll do a lot of reading. I'm going to stop the NB for now though and ask my vet to put her on a prescription diet until we decide to give raw a try again.

 

Thanks!

2bds2010's picture

Alternatives to raw

If raw doesn't work out for you, you can always try Sojo's or Honest Kitchen brand foods. They are simply prepared and air dryed human grade foods. A great alternative if you just can't do raw.

Laura, I hope I didn't

discourage you by giving you so much info. 

I was just concerned by your original post that you didn't understand the nature of raw feeding, i.e., how to begin and proceed with the smoothest transition.

Actually, it sounds as if raw would be the exact thing for your guy. It is really not difficult.

I am happy that you are reading and doing your homework. You will get many different views of how to feed raw. I try read the most knowledgable, and do what works for us. I do a mixture of raw primal diet and barf. I am a beginner and am doing what makes me comfortable as I proceed.

Some books that offer sound advice:

Raw Meaty Bones, Tom Lonsdale. Exhaustively researched, easy and entertaining to read, promotes a very basic, simple raw diet.

Work Wonders Feed Your Dog Raw Meaty Bones, Tom Lonsdale.

Unlocking the Canine Ancestral Diet

And then my old standby, the one that gave me the confidence to begin is Raw Dog Food Make it Easy for You and Your Dog, Carina Beth MacDonald.

Each of these books differ in some ways from the course that they use or recommend. That just helped me realize that if I devise what will work for me following their guidelines, I'll be okay. 

Kofi is thriving and I am relaxed and having fun. 

I refer to one or two of these sources almost daily. I love to read and discuss raw, but at the same time understanding that I must make the decisions that will be the best thing for Kofi and me.

Your vet, most probably, will discourage you from feeding raw, and be happy to supply you with a diet he has on hand.

Tom Lonsdale is a vet in Australia, and has done much to promote raw feeding. It would be the book (Raw Meaty Bones) to give to your vet if there was an interest in learning about raw.

Anyway, sorry if you were put off by the inundation of advice. Raw feeders just love to help and share.

Hugs!

 

 

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Kofi and Carol

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Katie and Chumlee MN's picture

I got Carina's book at Borders

It's a big book store by me I don't know if they are all over.  That way you can save on shipping and get it faster!!!

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Skasqueeeeeeakaaay!!

 

Katie & Chumlee


I sure miss the Borders!

Closest one to me is on the coast about 1&1/2 hours away. That's why I order so much from Amazon.

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Kofi and Carol

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over an hour away for me too

Our nearest Borders is in Austin and that's about an hour and a half away :(