Obedience help

Hello!  This is my first post here.  I have a 15 month old English bulldog named Gus.  I will note, he is like 1/4 beagle or something like that.  So he's getting older and is starting to settle down some, but I have several behavior issues and I would like advice on a series of training videos of the like that DO NOT endose positive reinforcement.

I took him to puppy class and he did very well, but all the trainers that I can find in my area push positive reinforcement, but I need help for when I can't be carrying treats.  When I carry treats, all he does is try to eat my pocket/hand/whatever they are in.  I have serious problems with pulling on walks and when we go to the dog park, I can't have treats becuase it could cause issues.  He's not aggressive, he's just really stubborn (duh), and it's hard to get his attention when he's focued on something.  He's neutered, but once he decides he wants to mount someone/thing, that's all he can focus on until I physically remove him from the situation.

I don't find books helpful as I'm the first person in my family to own a dog that can physically push you around (yes, I realize I probably am not the best owner for a bulldog), so noone has ever really taken these things seriously.  I need someone to actually show me, which is why I'd like a DVD.  Or, if anyone lives near Cleveland, Ohio and knows of a trainer that doesn't just want to bribe the dog, that would be great, too.  A trainer would be able to correct what I am doing wrong.

Like I said, he's not aggressive and actually very sweet and playful, loves people and other dogs too, but he's just so....hardcore.  It can be a little overwhelming and like, I can't really take him over to other people's houses for example my parents have 3 very small dogs and they are terrified of him because he wants to play SOOO bad and he's a little big and rough for them.

Keep in mind that I am in no means trying to blame him for this behavior, I need to fix how I discipline him.  But so far, I've only been taught how to bribe him. And there have only been a handful of times that I've been able to verbally correct him, but they were all "don't eat that, you're going to die!" moments.

Sorry this is so long, and thank you a head of time for any advice!

Dog behaviorist

I don't know of any DVD's, but I live in Nebraska and the city where I live has a dog behaviorist who uses some positive reinforcement, but also uses corrective behavior to let the dog know his behavior is unwanted. He is on FB and it is DogGoneProblems. His name is David Codr. He also has a website. At the very least, I would email him, tell him your issues and ask if there are any DVD's to help you learn how to help your bully. He might also know of someone to contact in your area to help you out.

Good luck...I know it can be frustrating!

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  Miss you sweet boy Otie (July 29, 2013)

 

 

Apparently, your instuctors didn't do a good job at

explaining or demonstrating what positive reinforcement is all about. Very basically, the more a behavior is reinforced, the more likely it is to be repeated. That includes all behavior, good and bad. Food treats are used to assist in getting and keeping your dogs attention, your dog can't learn if it isn't paying attention to you.

Rewarding an animal, any animal-humans included for a job well done helps to develop a habit or conditioned response. Let's say for example, you raise your right arm and someone says banana and hands you a $5.00 bill. So, you raise your right arm again, they repeat banana and again gives you a $5.00 bill. Wouldn't take you very long to learn or develop a conditioned response to the word banana. Repeated enough times, it would become a life time response, with or without the financial reward. Using food treats is only to establish the desired behavior and then eventually stopped.

Food isn't the only reward that can be used. Your dog wants to go outside, after he does a sit/wait, he is rewarded by being released to go. I've worked with plenty of dogs that were not food motivated, so owners have to get creative. I've used a short game of fetch, tug, a butt scratch, hound dogs are allowed to drop their noses for a good run of sniffing. I have found that mixing up the rewards keeps the dogs more interested and its more fun.

Teaching dogs takes tons of time and patience, I'm sure your instructors told you that. One thing that I noticed, owners are not consistent nor persistent, makes it very hard for the dog to learn and frustrating for both the dog and the owner.

In any sound training program, there has to be positive reinforcement, the dog has to know when its done something good. A decent instructor would be able to help you with the behaviors that you don't like. APDT has a website with an instructor locator, try them. You don't want to go to someone that uses harsh methods, it destroys the relationship between you and your dog. Remember, your dog is your best buddy and has to be able to trust you, so learning and teaching should be done as a team, not as adversaries.

Good luck

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Lynn King CPDT-KA

Forgot to mention

Dog Star Daily is a great website with lots of DVDs, books etc. that you might find useful.

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Lynn King CPDT-KA

Well, it's not really that

Well, it's not really that they didn't do a good job explaining it.  It's just that I cannot get his attention unless I have food in hand.  And then when I do, all he wants is the food, and he will do ANYTHING for it.  So if I want to run him through sit, down, stay, come, leave it, drop it, he'll do it over and over again for that treat (well, he's actually pretty bad at stay).

It's just that I would like to wean the treats and get him to pay attention without them, because it's not always practical to do it.  Also, the "uh uh uh" for "wrong" behavior doesn't impress him.  Like I said he's gone after a couple of items, such as the surge protector for the entertainment station, and I was able to channel a very firm "NO!" that not only got his attention, but prevented him from going it after it again.  Since this was a massive concern for him not getting electrocuted, it wasn't hard to do.  Since he's not always doing something life threatening, it's hard for me to get that firm voice for when he like, tries to play with the cat and corners it or wants to play with a much smaller dog.

I'm not necessarily saying I think positive reinforcement is bad, I just think I need coaching on how to be more strict and taught how to teach him things like heel and how to get his attention with my voice instead of food.  Mostly, because he's a bully some people are terrified of him with their dogs or even themselves and I would like more control of the situation from my end when there are distractions.  He's wonderful when it's just me and him at home, he trusts me very much, but outside he's not real impressed with me.

Thanks again, Erin

AmyandSophia's picture

You would do well to listen to Lynn King.

She is an extremely successful trainer/behaviorist who has been on BDW and helped a lot of people for many years. She is one of the best resources you will ever find for dog training, and if you are willing to listen to her and implement what is being told to you, both you and your boy will benefit greatly from her experience and advice.

You have spoiled your dog to gaining a food treat for doing a correct behavior. You need to replace that with a good belly rub, a positive whoop of praise, whatever it takes to get him to understand he is doing the right thing. People are not normally "afraid" of English Bulldogs, I have never come across someone who was afraid of my dog or others I have seen in stores or outdoors. If yours is causing fear, then his behavior is completely out of line and you need a good behaviorist to help you correct that problem. One thing, Beagles are a pain the butt to train, they ignore commands and can be very headstrong. If your dog has beagle mixed in, you can plan on having a slightly more difficult time getting a handle on him. Bulldogs are headstrong as well, but they react very well to positive reinforcement. Never, ever hit or slap your dog, it will only make a bulldog dig in and get stubborn. 

Best of luck to you. I hope you find the right solution for your boy.

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Amy and Sophia

The 4 D's of teaching, learning and behavior modification

Distance-Distraction-Difficulty-Duration

Let's start simple: We are going to teach a dog to sit. Dog is standing in front of you, happens to sit down, we say "sit", "yes-good job" and reward. Repeat everytime the dog sits. After doing this several times, the dog has now learned a conditioned response and will automatically sit the first time they hear the word. What we tend to do is, Dog is standing in front of us and we say "sit" several times until the dog finally sits out of boredom and we say "yes-good job" and reward. Doing it this way, the dog learns to sit only after repeated commands. Believe me, teaching the dog using the first technique results in a much cleaner response.

So now, our dog drops it's butt everytime we say "sit". Does it perfectly in the house, we can now start to wean off the treats, maybe give a treat the first time you ask for it, then have the Dog sit 3 times and then reward, move to the 7th time, back to the first time etc. Vary the reward pattern and eventually, while in the house, you won't have to reward. Now you want to take your dog outside where the Distraction level increases. Practice the same thing and don't move to increased Distraction until he has that level accomplished. Add in a little Duration and Distance but don't try to jump forward too fast.

Using "No" or any other word when you are trying to stop them from doing something just has to be said in a firm, clear tone and be sure to follow through. I use "knock it off" and my dogs always knew to stop whatever they were doing. You can also teach "leave it" but again, be sure to let him know what a good boy he is when he responds correctly.

Asking a dog to respond to our commands before we have properly taught them only frustrates everyone. For example, taking a dog to a dog park and then getting frustrated when we call them and they ignore us.

For now, I suggest that you pick just a couple of skills to work on, solidify them, then add a few more. To me, coming when called was always the most important skill. Depending on the dog and the situation, I still heavily rewarded for a prompt response. We had a JRT mix who loved to chase joggers, bad idea, but he would come to me instantly when called. I could call him off of any distraction but because he was so stimulated by his environment and because it was so important that he respond, I continued to reward him with all kinds of treats/play/ etc., his entire life.

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Lynn King CPDT-KA